A Farewell to Billy Turner
Those who are regulars here can expect to read mostly feel-good stories with feel-good endings. This is not one of them. Who Billy Turner was and how he treated people and shared the gift of Seattle Slew is indeed a feel-good story, but where life led him is not. To those reading this, it is not meant to feel sorry for Turner, but to open one’s eyes to the sometimes harsh realities we must face. ~ Steve Haskin
A Farewell to Billy Turner
By Steve Haskin
Seattle Slew was not just another all-time great; not just one of a small iconic group of horses to sweep the Triple Crown. And not just one of the fastest horses of all time, For 41 years he was the only undefeated Triple Crown winner in the history of the sport, plucked out of a yearling sale for a meager $17,500. His story was meant to be one of racing’s great Cinderella fairy tales, and the first few chapters read as such, as his fame spread around the world. But then, somehow, the story began to unravel, as did all the major characters. Billy Turner, the true hero of the story and the architect of what would become arguably racing’s great equine dynasty, should have used his masterful training job with Seattle Slew as a springboard to success, stardom, and a place in racing’s Hall of Fame.
But that didn’t happen. Despite eventually conquering the alcohol demons that got him fired as trainer of Seattle Slew, a move he fully understood at the time, Turner’s career plummeted into racing’s abyss, a dark and empty place inhabited by cheap, mostly unsound, New York-breds, and even those dwindled down to four or five until the Thoroughbred finally was gone completely from Turner’s life. All that was left was the memory of one of the greatest horses of all time and their magical journey together through the Triple Crown.
At first, it looked as if Turner’s success would continue when he won the 1980 Metropolitan Handicap with William Reynolds’ Czaravich. But that would be his last hurrah.
As the mega-trainers came along with hundreds of horses, dominating the sport, there was no longer room for Billy Turner, despite his unmatched credentials. Many thought for sure they would have given him a lifetime access to good horses and a pathway to success. But credentials, no matter how impressive, are worthless if no one acknowledges them. And racing’s prominent owners either forgot or chose to forget the extraordinary skills of a lifetime horsemen, who took a speed crazy colt and turned him into a legend.
For the next four decades following Slew’s Triple Crown sweep, the only time Turner’s name was in the news was when the media contacted him to ask his opinion about a Derby and Preakness winner who was on the verge of making history. It became evident to Turner and his wife Pat, who he met at an AA meeting in 1991 and married in 1998, that Billy’s racing life had been relegated to the past. The present was fading quickly and there seemed to be no future.
All he had to cling to was the title of racing’s only living Triple Crown winning trainer, a title many fans felt should have gotten him into the Hall of Fame, but the years passed and those doors never even opened a crack.
All Turner could do over the years was train the few cheap New York-breds he was given and wait for a phone call that never came.
“The owners we did have cared about Bill, but all they had were unsound New York-breds who Bill had to back off on for months at a time,” Pat said. “It was a struggle watching him train those horses and so depressing to go to the barn every day. Bill was always known for his training of Slew, but his real genius was taking horses no one wanted and turning them into winners, but these were beyond his capabilities. We finally got down to three to five horses and couldn’t even feed ourselves. When Bill was forced to declare bankruptcy in 2015 it ripped the heart out of him.”
That was the same year Turner finally lost his title as the only living Triple Crown winning trainer, a title he held since Laz Barrera’s death in 1991. Despite falling on hard times and his career hanging by a thread, Turner was genuinely thrilled for American Pharoah, his connections, and most of all the sport and the fans, who had to wait 37 years to celebrate racing’s greatest achievement.
“I think it’s great,” Turner said the night of the Belmont Stakes. “If we didn’t get it done right about now it would have hurt racing’s fan base. You couldn’t have held the public’s attention much longer. I thought American Pharoah ran the best race of his life and improved with every race through the Triple Crown.”
That was typical of Turner, who never had any bitterness toward Slew’s owners, Karen and Mickey Taylor and Jim and Sally Hill for firing him or for the drastic decline in his career.
“I never heard him be bitter about anything or say one bad word about the Hills and Taylors,” Pat said. “If anything, he was too hard on himself. He took everything to heart.”
Turner said back in the early ‘90s he had no animosity toward the Taylors and Hills for the breakup. “There’s no bitterness at all,” he said. “We all made mistakes, but we’ve grown and learned a lot. If I was in their position I would have done the same thing. I appreciate everything they did for me and have no hard feelings whatsoever. I just feel very fortunate to have had a horse like Slew come along in my lifetime. Luckily, even with my problem I was able to appreciate everything Slew accomplished as a 4-year-old. The alcohol didn’t finish me off for another six or seven years following Slew. After practically drinking myself to death I still was able to make a solid comeback and am grateful for everything. Here I am the only living trainer to have won the Triple Crown. I figure I’ve gotten a lot more than I deserve.”
Seattle Slew’s groom John Polston recalled, “I didn’t know all the details, but I really enjoyed working for Billy. I knew Billy before I knew the Taylors and the Hills. You could walk up to him and ask him for 20 dollars and whether he knew you or not he’d give it to you. Billy is one of those happy-go-lucky guys, but he really didn’t like the publicity. When Billy left, he just wished me good luck. I could tell he was hurt. I still couldn’t believe a guy who had just won the Triple Crown would get fired. We all knew Billy liked to drink, but as far as I’m concerned he was always a good trainer.”
Hall of Fame trainer P.G. Johnson once told Pat, “If I had a trainer who was drinking and he won the Triple Crown I would buy him the bar.”
Jim Hill explained, “Billy could do the right thing with the horse, but he just couldn’t do the right thing with himself.” Sally Hill added, “People do get divorced. It certainly wasn’t what any of us wanted.”
As it turned out, the Hills and Taylors also got divorced, and their partnership was dissolved following a heated court battle, with Hill suing Taylor for misappropriation of funds. The” Slew Crew” was no more. The multi-million dollar kingdom they had built from a $17,500 yearling had come crumbling down as quickly as it shot up. As Turner said, “Slew became so big that it just consumed everybody involved.”
In the years following Slew, Turner waited for his next big opportunity, but he was not the type to go out there and try to sell himself, unlike the new breed of trainers that were coming into the sport. Turner was a humble, gentle soul who just loved horses, but apparently that wasn’t enough.
His first wife, Paula, knew he wasn’t cut out for the dog-eat-dog world of Thoroughbred racing and having to hustle to get horses.
She recalled their first date: “It was on the banks of the Brandywine River, near Unionville, Pennsylvania. Billy had his binoculars to his eyes, watching birds and I sat on a rock singing Simon and Garfunkel songs. I realized this interesting, brilliant guy loved nature and horses as much as I did. He was so shy and modest. Billy had been immersed in a hard-living culture, with its hard knocks the norm. I saw the difficulty of such a shy soul trying to make his way in a world where success often depends on how well you put yourself out there…talking to potential owners, when you’re only truly at home with the horses. It eventually took its toll.”
Paula also recalled the early days when Seattle Slew came into their life. She had grown up in an orphanage and kept having the same recurring dream. “I was a horse-crazy kid with no access to horses other than through books and westerns. I kept dreaming that I rode and trained a black stallion, and as we flew faster and faster he told me he was the fastest horse in the world.”
Paula told Billy about her dream after they were married when she realized he had been a successful steeplechase jockey from the photos on his parents’ wall. Then one day, years later, when she was training and galloping horses at Mrs. Henry Obrey’s Andor Farm in Monkton, Maryland, she was sent a big, near-black colt owned by the Hills and Taylors that eventually was going to be sent to Billy in New York. He was still kind of raw and clumsy and she nicknamed him Huey after the gawky cartoon character Baby Huey. Also, his right front leg turned out sharply from the knee down and he was a bit slow to learn; he thought everything was a game. But he soon began to learn his lessons well and it was time to send him and two other horses to Billy.
Then came his first gallop; his first look at a racetrack. That is when Paula realized this was the horse in her dreams. As he flew around the track, she thought, “This feels better than any stakes horse; this is like nothing I’ve ever known.” He had the “power of a locomotive and the grace of Nureyev,” and as she put it, “We were in another universe altogether.”
She jogged back to Billy and told him, “This is it, Willy. This is it.” He replied, “What are you talking about?” Then she said the words that would change his life, “Huey. He’s the one you’ve been waiting for.”
The following year, Seattle Slew and Billy Turner became household names and made history together. Turner was praised for his handling of Slew and getting this blazing-fast horse who ran seven furlongs in a track-record 1:20 3/5 in his 3-year-old debut to win not only the Kentucky Derby but the Belmont Stakes. After that allowance race, Turner asked, “How am I going to get this horse to go a mile and a half?” With all his steeplechase training he was able to get him to relax and the Belmont turned out to be the easiest of all his stakes victories. Baby Huey had become the first undefeated Triple Crown winner.
But the relationship between Turner and the Taylors and the Hills began to deteriorate over several disagreements, including running him in the Swaps Stakes at Hollywood Park only three weeks after the Belmont Stakes; a race in which he suffered his first career defeat, finishing a dismal fourth. That would be his last race as a 3-year-old and the last time he would be trained by Turner.
Between their disagreements and Turner’s drinking problem, it was decided to send Seattle Slew to another trainer for his 4-year-old campaign, in which he would stamp himself as one of the all-time greats. Turner had some success after that, but his drinking problem got worse and his career began to suffer. Then he met Pat.
Despite Billy and Pat both conquering their demons, his career continued to decline. No owners would send him good horses. He finally was forced to retire several years ago and he and Pat moved to Florida when she got a job at Pavla and Erik Nygaard’s farm breaking 2-year-olds who were going through the sale.
“Billy came to the farm to be around the horses but it was tough on him,” she said. “It was painful for him to be around horses and not be involved in any way. The last few years were very difficult.”
One morning, about two years ago, Turner suffered a broken neck in a mowing accident and had a long and painful recovery. Pat said it was Bob Baffert who donated “a significant amount of money for his care.” While in ICU it was discovered he had prostate cancer that had spread to his bones.
This past December 17, at age 81, he was admitted to the hospital suffering from shortness of breath, and tests revealed the cancer had spread to his lungs. He chose not to receive further treatment and on December 27, he was sent home under hospice care.
With medical costs spiraling out of control, the Nygaards set up a GoFundMe page for Turner and agreed to match up to $10,000 of funds raised.
On December 31, Pat crawled into bed with Billy and held him in her arms. “He died very gently a half hour later,” she said.
Pat was numb for several days before it all overwhelmed her. “Today I feel like I hit a brick wall,” she said. “I can’t believe all the outpouring of love and admiration people had for Billy.”
She thought back to that fall day in 1991 when she first met Billy at the AA meeting in Middleburg, Virginia and there was instant compatibility as they talked about many things in addition to recovery and horses.
“From that day on there wasn’t a moment I’ve had with Billy that wasn’t comforting,” she said. “Billy made everyone around him comfortable, from the owners to the backstretch workers.”
Anyone who knew Billy Turner is well aware he would not want any tears shed for him. At the end he might very well have been recalling the time he shed tears. That was when he attempted to talk about the death of his beloved Seattle Slew. They now reside together in racing’s pantheon.
Photo by Steve Haskin
RE possible Kentucky resentment, of Bob’s success….in the 70’s Cali entrants weren’t doing so well, in the Derby—1975 Cali horses were battling for the win, before colliding, at the 1/8 pole . .Whittingham won two, in the 80’s, and also got a 2nd…Gregson had Gato Del Sol, but it’s only been in past 20 years, that west coast horses have been winning the Roses in bunches, maybe they ARE upset about that!
interview about Flightline…….Youtube …….thoroughbred daily news channel…………..
Hi Steve,
Thank you for your sensitive and honest portrayal of one of horse racing’s least appreciated horsemen.
I work for a Christian inner-city Mission here in Winnipeg. Most of the people we help have had alcohol and / or drug struggles. Most of them have had childhood abuse issues (usually emotional abuse from their fathers) which has scarred them to the point where they find rare peace and solace in escaping. Those of us who are clean and sober and who haven’t struggled with these issues likely “self-medicate” ourselves at times with shopping (retail therapy) or eating treats. My biggest weakness is dark chocolate. In many ways, all people are alike.
I would never consider any of those I work with to be irresponsible or not worthy of work. With support and (often) through forgiveness, they can move beyond their struggles and challenges.
I realize it is unfair to compare today with the 1970s – a time when people held more rigid (and less sympathetic) views about drug and alcohol use and users – but it is heartbreaking to read your article about how a person who no one seemed to have a bad word to say about him – either as a person or a horseman – could be cast aside so ignobly.
Thinking back on the 1970s and the triple crown winners and near misses, I can’t think of another trainer who existed so under the spotlight than Billy Turner (with the possible exception of Juan Arias, the trainer of Canonero II.)
Billy Turner deserved a better fate. I say this at a time when the word “deserved” is overused and is applied to people deserving a new car, a better job, a Happy Meal. Mr. Turner was everything an owner would want in a trainer – a man who would care for their charges as though the horses was his own, and a trainer who could bring out the best in the horse.
It would be a deserved though belated honor to see Billy Turner inducted into the Horse Racing Hall of Fame. He deserves it as much for not quitting the sport he loved after it had turned its back on him as much for his work in turning a $17,500 purchase into one of the most influential horses and stallions of my lifetime.
greg (Fan of Damascus)
Thank you so much, Greg. So good to hear from you again, I appreciate you providing your first hand knowledge of the people and the problem. It is very sincere and enlightening. Keep up the great work.
Great post my friend!
You are to be commended for your constructive job in the community.
Keep it up !
and try to make a little time to share your views under Steve’s blogosphere…
Todd Pletcher’s promising colt, Emmanuel, was back on the track today, (1-15), recording a bullet 4 furlong work in 48.43, 1/22, at Palm Meadows. He spiked a fever prior to racing in an allowance race, on 1-7, and was scratched by the track Vet.
Emmanuel broke his maiden at first asking, going a mile in 1:36.47, drawing off by 6 3/4 lengths, at GP. By More Than Ready, out of a Hard Spun mare, he appears to be a colt with plenty of upside moving forward.
Lots to like about this colt in my opinion.
Yes indeed Lynda, there’s a lot to like about Emmanuel.
Just to be clear, I’m not trying to upstage our host, posting the first edition of his Derby Dozen (next week), but I thought I would list my top 12 contenders on the Derby trail.
Rattle N Roll
Simplification
Epicenter
Emmanuel
My Prankster
Slow Down Andy
Smile Happy
Pappacap
Chasing Time
Mo Donegal
Classic Causeway
Joe
I’m starting to watch the works again….Messier looked fantastic today
Until Messier is transferred to another barn, I’ll not be using him or any other BB colt on the Derby trail.
RNR has zero works. I like Brown’s horse.
Like your list Bill have many of them on my list.
Thanks Lynda
Would you care to post your top 12? Maybe you and some of the regulars will post their lists just to compare how they stack up against Steve’s Derby Dozen when he posts next week.
Not in any particular order yet:
Rattle N Roll
Commandperformance
Tiz The Bomb
Emmanuel
Zandon
Slow Down Andy
Smile Happy
Pappacap
Chasing Time
Jack Christopher
Classic Causeway
Simplification
Giant Game
Hi Lynda
I just finished reading Steve’s “Derby Rankings Week 1”, your list included 10 of his top 14 horses. My list included 9 of his top 14, and I had 2 in his KOTD segment, (Emmanuel & Joe). It appears you and I are right there or thereabouts with our rankings versus Steve’s. 🙂
Good luck moving forward on the Derby trail.
He was very impressive.
great!
This was so bittersweet and really heartbreaking at the same time. I knew Mr. Turner had problems but never
realized that his life was so hard for such a long period of time. Thank GOD he had Pat. I think she must
be a gem to realize what an amazing person she married. He was a brilliant trainer and it speaks volumes
about what is wrong with humans and the sport that no one would give him a shot again. Once you
have a reputation for alcoholism, people are reluctant to give you a chance. But the reality is that all people
deal with it differently and many are able to function at their previous levels. They just need a chance.
When I think of Seattle Slew, I do not think of anyone else associated with him but Billy Turner. it will be forever
that way for me. I think he did his absolute best for Slew and i think he tried to keep him from being mishandled
by his other connections. A special place in heaven for that alone.
I think it is quite wonderful that Bob Baffert came to their aid financially when he was at his sickest. None of us
is one dimensional and this is the truly kind and generous side of Bob Baffert.
You are right about the negative consequences of Alcoholism on social interactions. It hampers performance and limits career opportunities.
That is why it is so lifting to see Kent Desormeaux’s impressive come back.
Thank God there are so many people who love and care about him…!
I’m hoping Oviatt Class does well during the Derby trail for the exact same reason. Great to see.
I am with you there Davids. The beautiful son of Bernardini is screaming for longer races… A Desormeaux Derby will be a heck of a story… truly inspiring !
Like OC.
Thank you Paula..,compassionate and empathetic words for a flawed human being just like me and the rest of us…see the Apostle Paul.
Agree with you wholeheartedly! (on all points)
I used to watch the Santa Anita works, one day a week….would have breakfast at Clockers Corner…I was not there but heard about Risie–who would seat you and she also sold Racing Forms …..someone stole $400 that she had from the sales, and Bob just gave her four $100’s..
Rosie.
Good post, Paula. I thought Bob Baffert’s kindness toward Billy Turner was admirable as well.
“For of all sad words of tongue or pen, The saddest are these: ‘It might have been.’ ” Such an amazing partnership Turner had with the outstanding Seattle Slew. But it’s hard not to think what his life, extraordinary as it was at times, could have been. Thank you for this compassionate take on a complicated, beautiful and talented soul, may he rest in peace.
Well said. Thank you
WRONG!
I’m saying this to everybody. How about keeping your comments relevant to Steve’s post It’s getting sickening seeing long winded sililoquies that don’t pertain to the subject Steve has graciously wrote for us. He doesn’t have to do this and the people who don’t stick to the subject are showing a lack of respect for him and the rest of is who truly enjoy his works. If you want a debate the first thing you have to do is stick to the subject!!!!!!!!!
Thank you!! Derek. I allowed it this time because it is the last column before the Derby Rankings, but it ruins the whole flow of the subject matter. The person below who constantly tries my patience is on slippery ground and I wont tell him again. I gave him his final warning. Also the administrator, whose patience is running thin with certain posters, will be laying down the law in next week’s comments. It was his idea and being it is his website I back him fully.
That is great. Without rules there is chaos.
So true Roberta, so very true!
BRAVO Derek!!!
You remind me of CF.
I recently saw a blog tiled as follows – The 3 best KD Prospects not trainer by Bob Baffert. I was appalled.
Whilst BB has won seven KDs. this shouldn’t give rise to such a theme for a blog. It represents a gross disrespect of other trainers.
Nowhere in Europe would there be any blogger that would highlight the 3 best Epsom Derby prospects not trained by Aidan O’Brien. Trainer O’Brien has been just as dominant in the Epsom Derby as BB has been in the KD. But those with knowledge of the sport are well aware that there is no monopoly in any Derby. Success is only for a season or a few. Who would a have thought that Charlie Appleby would have emerged the TC force he has become?
Steve Haskin’s comments involving Bob Baffert also captured my attention – Derby Rankings is gonna start off crazy until a Baffert decision is made on all counts. That left me less appalled, but this comment still had me wondering why Bob Baffert is being mentioned.
Both statements though different in context, infers that BB’s KD prospects should first be assessed before a determination can be made of all others. I consider same grossly inappropriate and a blatant disregard for history. See Below:
In 2019 BB was represented in the KD by the Champion 2YO (Game winner); SA Derby winner (Roadster) and KD Post time favorite (Improbable). None of the aforementioned hit the board. Those were the best 3 KD prospects not trained by other trainers, and they finished amongst the also ran.
After winning the KD with War Emblem in 2002. BB didn’t win the KD for the next 12 years, despite being represented by 8 plus entrants. BB isn’t the only trainer that has had a period of repeated success. Wayne Lukas in his prime was just as dominant for a 5 years period
Mr. Baffert is banned from submitting entrants to the KD for the next 2 years. Why have some seen it fit to disregard this cold fact and still reference him in relation to Derby prospects, is baffling.
Why is there no apparent regard for the decision made by CDI due to BB’s scroll of violations? By mentioning a banned trainer in relation to KD prospects. Doesn’t this indicate failure to acknowledge the severity of his transgressions. Why provide him with the undeserving attention. Mr. Baffert should be treated like the repeated offender he is. He is not to be revered. Certainly not by men of repute.
Choosing to reference a trainer whilst he is under sanction, could inadvertently signal the endorsement of a trainer who has brought the sport into disrepute.
No one man is bigger than the sport irrespective of his record of achievements.
I know you dont pay attention so I will tell you once again for the last time. First off, Dont ever bring up another blog on here and if you want to ignore the fact that Bob Baffert has several Derby horses that likely will have to go to other trainers if they are going to get to the Derby and are still in limbo you can do so, but dont bring this up again or your comments will be deleted, as this one should have been.
It’s the white elephant in the room corner…how CAN you make a Derby Dozen WITHOUT mentioning it….
garbage……
oBVIOUSLY , EddieF did not leave because of a comment. They probably turned his internet off, or lost his house. Hard to believe he bet.
Pro = classless!
No worries. I doubt he’ll be around much longer unless he learns how to respect people. You will see what I mean next week when Leonard, who owns this website, steps in.
I remember him from many years back and he’s always been the same nasty person. I’m sure he’s of an advanced age and when we get to that point we can’t change our personality. Eddie could be sick or worse and provet makes bad jokes.
I miss Eddie.
I have enjoyed Eddie’s sense of humor. He may be a bit prickly at times, but nearly all of us are. His comments have made me laugh more than a few times. I hope he’s okay.
Agreed!
What the heck is wrong with you that you would say such a thing?
Opening First Saturday in May…..”I’ll Have Another Couple”, a Paul Reddam Production! Directed by Doug O’Neill, co-starring Mario Gutierrez, and introducing Slow Down Andy, as “Threepeat”…..special guest Star Lava Man, as himself!
The last KD winner to sire a KD winner was Unbridled. Before him it was Seattle Slew. This has been highlighted to indicate the rarity of the occurrence and the historic hurdle Slow Down Andy has to negotiate. He has to be significantly better than his generation to win the KD. But then, there is always luck.
I like him cuz he ran so green, and beat Bob B’s horse (whom he likes, and seemed to fire–Prat said “no excuse”), and it was his first time two turns….trainer did not want to run/was genuinely surprised he won—in a year that has not yet been clearly defined as to whom is going to go on and improve—here’s a horse that has at least bucked a strong trend: he beat Bob, in a race at Los Al that he has owned., and he seems to have upside…gets the cheaters next, blinkers off of a win.
Also you think he has to be significantly better than the rest because of a statistic.. .Derby winner siring a Derby winner—there has been 2 in past 37 years,…..I do look at trends, at handicapping angles, THAT one is not one of them, you could have said Bob never lost the Los Al Futurity—until he did.
Many people here consider trends in their handicapping. I do too, but I always ask a question: “Why is it so?” If I don’t have a reasonable answer, I move on. I would move on from the derby winner/sire “trend”.
You are very wise.
Thank you Steve. But I probably learned that from you way back when.
I was responding to his post, sometimes I’m not clear enough…I never gave the Derby winner/sire of winner ANY thought!
Oh no, Matthew! You were VERY clear. I didn’t think you bought into the winner/sire thing. I was only following up in the conversation, and really didn’t want to reply directly with the thread initiator.
Lovely article- I think the stories surrounding greatness and all it’s miraculous connections are fascinating!! Thank you
Thanks, Kerri.
When you learn the type of person Billy Turner was and the fondness people developed for him, it warms the heart that he was the one that got to navigate the career of Slew and enjoy the fruits of his labor and, I’m sure, the pure joy of watching his horse run. Paula’s comments, “This feels better than any stakes horse; this is like nothing I’ve ever known.” He had the “power of a locomotive and the grace of Nureyev,” and as she put it, “We were in another universe altogether.” This is how I felt when I saw American Pharoah run at Oaklawn. You can only hope you get moments like these in your lifetime.
Well said, Tex.
Dozen years ago,had good fortune of meeting Bill Nack. Your writing is in another stratosphere of any I’ve ever read related to racing.
It’s hard to tell who youre referring to. If me, thank you very much, but Bill’s writing certainly is in another stratosphere.
I’m referring to you.
That’s very kind of you. Thank you very much.
I just wanted to throw in my three cents about about contributors of days past. This is the nature of discussion groups on the internet. People come and they go. I remember all of those mentioned and they were wonderful. Windolin and BelmontBarb were always informative and thoughtful. My recollection is that Windolin just finally couldn’t support racing because of the treatment of horses. Dr Drunkinbum was hilarious, and he knew racing inside out. I believe when Eddie was Nick (LOL) he had a profile photo that along with his good humor and his smarts made me consider hunting him down even if he was 20 years younger than me. Ha ha! Nevertheless new folks come on board and the cycle of life goes on.
I totally agree, and if someone who is one of the top posters on here and certainly one of the most popular suddenly decides to leave without saying a word, that is his prerogative. I would just be disappointed if the reason he left is because he took offense to some innocuous comment, especially when he can dish it out and always in a clever way, Yes. I’ve always wondered what happened to Windolin, Belmont Barb, and Native Dancer and so many other regulars, but I fully understand people have their own lives to live away from here. And new people show up to replace them. Dr. D, Nick Carraway, and EddieF, who were all very similar, were fun and informative, and all just disappeared. I only asked about Eddie hoping he’s OK. Obviously he decided overnight, as the other two did, not to return. I only wish him the best. We all will miss him.
Steve, Nelson Maan is Native Dancer.
If memory serves, he used both names in the BloodHorse days. Not sure about this site because I just found it a couple of weeks ago. And I thought it was understood in those days when Eddie F appeared that he was Nick Carraway reincarnated.
That’s what most everyone thought. Both made sudden exits.
Yes, Roberta, Disqus made changes a couple of times which affected those who contributed on The Blood-Horse’s various blogs. Earlier The Blood-Horse website had two chat forums where members could voice an opinion.
Oh, I didnt realize that. Happy he’s still here.
Probably lost more than we actually know….Laz, Mary Z (whom might be still alive), Saratoga AJ, Drayray etc….
Mary Z is mary Y on bloodhorse and Hrn……….she is the only one that knows my true identity…..ask her if i have a 30% win % as an owner…..and 70+ in the money %………..she is a friend and a really big BRAT.
I’m only interested in what Mary X has to say.
That made me giggle. Mary Alphabet!! Lol.
John, have u heard from Laz? We’ve exchanged emails.
Mike, no I haven’t nor have read anything from him in a long time…
He’s a good one! We were huge fans of Zen. Hope he’s well
Our host has indicated that his Derby Rankings is gonna start off crazy until a Baffert decision is made on all counts. I find said disclosure interesting for a number of reasons.
CDI’s decision is final. The organization doesn’t intend to reverse its decision. This was made clear in an internal memo issued by the CEO which reaffirmed the organization’s commitment to hold BB accountable for the damage he has done. The memo further stated that the organization is prepared to meet him in court any time of his choosing. The preponderance of evidence is in CDI’s favor and consequently any thoughts of a likely reversal of the 2 years ban must be viewed as a fantasy.
I concur that the 3YOs currently being trained by BB are in limbo. But that this is due to the owner’s decision. History reveals that horses transferred from BB’s barn have not displayed the same level of performance. The quicker the program change is contemplated, the better it will for the procurement of points and the negative effect of the program change.
Ken Mc Peek’s 4 on the trail will likely occupy prime rankings. There are likely to be in contention with probably 3 form the Asmussen barn. Todd Pletcher has about 3 decent prospects. Mark Casse has 2. Dale Romans has 2 decent colts. Chad brown has 2 nice colts.
Ignoring the Baffert contingent. The top 12 should emerge from the barns highlighted above. There would be nothing crazy about a top 12 from this group. But then, there are other 3YOs who are not as prominent that could add craziness to the mix.
Well I say shame on Churchill Downs if that’s their final decision. It’s not good for the Derby and it seems petty in my humble opinion.
They certainly have made up their mind that Bob Baffert is evil, not good for fhe Derby image, and no longer is welcome. One might ask, but he’s won the Derby 7 times and has won it in 2015, 2018, 2020, and 2021. Just perhaps that is really why he no longer is good for the Derby. They are sick of him winning, and then to come up positive, what a great excuse to get rid of him and give others a chance. After all, if Bob Baffert can make winning the Derby look so easy, that’s not a good image for America’s biggest race that is supposed to be so hard to win. Not saying that is the case here. Just a thought that it might not be as crazy as one would think.
That’s not crazy speculation, but I’m thinking it’s not because he wins the Derby so often. It’s because he gets violations in so many big races including the derby. There’s also the SA Derby/Justify fiasco where the state protocol wasn’t followed, and that allowed Justify to qualify for the Kentucky Derby. In my mind, it’s the violations, not the wins.
You could very well be right. The violations didnt seem to bother them until it happened in the Derby. So it seems like it’s more protecting their brand than for the good of racing. Bottom line is they can do whatever they want. They are a private company. But let’s save any more discussions on Bob’s 3-year-olds and the ban for the Derby Rankings next week.
Will do! Looking forward to it very much.
Why do you call the Justify thing a fiasco?…….it was a nothing. proved to be a nothing.
Just to follow up a few thoughts about Seattle Slew. I was at Hollywood Park when J.O. Tobin upset him in the Swaps Stakes.
I happen to bet Tobin that day. I just making that long trip to the west coast wouldn’t be in his best interest.
If I had a contention on Slew’s Triple Crown would only be that I didn’t feel the quality he faced were near as good as some of the other Triple Crown. It’s only a small contention but Slew was brilliant in many of his later races. I watched when beat Affirmed & Exceller so that added to his legacy.
This story about Billy Turner was very heart felt, I learned a lot the man thanks to your brilliant blog.
You always out do yourself.
Every story you tell is an encore to the last story.
Unless I missed it I would really like to see a story about one of my favorite fillies, Dark Mirage.
Thank you writing this piece, it was marvelous!!!
Thank you Deacon. I’ve been planning on one for a while. I just have to put it all together. With Derby Rankings starting Monday there wont be any columns for several months unless something comes up and I need to write one.
Steve, I’m really looking forward to your Derby Dozen this year. In particular, which colts you are really impressed with and how the Bob Baffert ban will impact the Derby. Can’t wait.
Gonna start off crazy until a Baffert decision is made on all counts. Those horses are all in limbo.
Horses transferred from BB’s barn have not been burning up the track. The program change can have a negative impact.
You talking about a negative impact, priceless.
LOL
Topic is Billy and Slew. Perhaps you forgot.
Unrea, CF.
Unreal!
Thanks Steve for this touching homage to Billy Turner Jr., a great Horseman who “talked more to the horses than to the people”. Billy Turner, as you said, is the maker of Seattle Slew’s immortality and all the joyful memories and elation of all his races.
Turner’s famous quote about Seattle Slew’s future after his 2-year-old championship stating “If he doesn’t win the Triple Crown I haven’t done my job.”, is a testament to the Horseman’s sense of responsibility, honesty and integrity.
Turner did not have support after parting ways with Seattle Slew but his great training skills led Strike Gold and Play On to excellent 3-year-old campaigns in 1983 and 1981 respectively.
His second best horse was Punch Line who won all the G2 sprint Stakes in 1997 and 1998.
Turner also did an impeccable job with Gaviola leading her to a 6-win streak including 4 Stakes in 2000. The daughter of Cozzene was later sold for $1,900,000 in foal to Gone West…
The last Stakes horse trained by Turner was Dry Martini in 2009.
The following links takes you to the last interview to Turner last December.
***youtube.com/watch?v=3VaMQ-gP-3E***
My condolences to Turner’s Family and friends.
God Bless all the people who have helped William H. Turner, Jr. in his good and critical years.
Most People dont realize he got fired as trainer for Robert Lehmann and then had to watch his favorite horse for Lehmann, Dust Commander, win the Derby. He was sick over it.
Yes Steve … Turner was 29 years old then.
Turner always said that Lehman’s was the strongest stable he’s ever worked for but the owner did not like the fact that out of the fifteen 2-year-old horses in training ‘only’ seven had won by July…!
Lehmann was not very fond Turner’s patience and horsemanship… I guess.
No he wasnt. After he won the Derby he said on the winner’s stand that it wasnt as gratifying as big game hunting and bagging a tiger. That didnt go over too well.
That says all you need to know about the man as a thoroughbred owner… and probably as a human being.
Perhaps John Lennon was right about “Instant Karma”…in 2008 the tiger got it’s revenge on Mr Lehman in some respect. How repugnant, killing such a beautiful animal. Big game hunting, what an incongruous term.
My comment was “awaiting moderation” because I included a link to the last interview given by Ted Turner last December.
I hope that searching for “Triple Crown winning trainer of Seattle Slew, Billy Turner, w/ California native Andrea Baxter.” will take you that affectionate video…!
It’s up there.
Thanks Steve for this touching homage to Ted Turner Jr., a great Horseman who “talked more to the horses than to the people”. Ted Turner, as you said, is the maker of Seattle Slew’s immortality and all the joyful memories and elation of all his races.
Turner’s famous quote about Seattle Slew’s future after his 2-year-old championship stating “If he doesn’t win the Triple Crown I haven’t done my job.”, is a testament to the Horseman’s sense of responsibility, honesty and integrity.
Turner did not have support after parting ways with Seattle Slew but his great training skills led Strike Gold and Play On to excellent 3-year-old campaigns in 1983 and 1981 respectively.
His second best horse was Punch Line who won all the G2 sprint Stakes in 1997 and 1998.
Turner also did an impeccable job with Gaviola leading her to a 6-win streak including 4 Stakes in 2000. The daughter of Cozzene was later sold for $1,900,000 in foal to Gone West…
The last Stakes horse trained by Turner was Dry Martini in 2009.
The following link takes you to the last interview given by Ted Turner last December … it starts at 16 minutes and 20 seconds in the video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VaMQ-gP-3E
I can say that his love for horses kept him alive and in good spirit for very long time…!
My condolences to Patti Rich, daughter Nelle Durizch, son Liam, and stepdaughter Jessica Rich. Let consolation be in knowing that every one loved, admired and respected the legendary Trainer.
God Bless all the people who have helped William H. Turner, Jr. in his good and critical years.
Correction: William Turner … not Ted!!!
Apologies !
I should not write while watching Jane Fonda’s movies…!
Which Jane Fonda movie were you watching? Coming Home and Klute were probably her two best films.
I was watching the Golden Pond with her father…
My cable provider is providing a free preview of a Hollywood suite cable channel with movies from the 70s, 80s, 90s and 2000s …it shows a lot of great old movies featuring great actors…
The channel (HollywoodSuite) lists Klute but I do not see the movie “Coming Home” after searching for it there…
Nelson, do try an see “Coming Home” – just buy it – the soundtrack alone is worth hearing. Brilliant film.
I will Davids… How come you know so much about movies… Are you a writer or Director?
Nelson, I worked in the Film industry for a long time but even prior film was a favorite pastime, along with racing. Reading plays and screenplays was an addictive habit as well. After the 90s film lost it’s magic for me.
I is nice to know… I am glad you are still enjoying Horse Racing… I feel like racing history is a fertile ground for decent scripts…
Oh my! Are you David Soul?
Ha ha ha ha!
It is nice to know…
Steve, thank you for this – I’m tearing up. I’m so sorry Billy never received the due he deserved, just like Slew never did for a long time. Billy deserved so much better than what the industry gave him; the fact that he wasn’t bitter floors me.
I am certain that Slew was waiting for him …now they are together again..
Billy was rare in that regard. No bitterness. Maybe he realized that having Slew was something 99.9 of the trainers can only dream about
Based on what I’ve read about him, I’ll bet that’s how he felt. He puts me to shame, that I know…
I remember going to Hialeah with my dad to see the Flamingo stakes in 1977. I turned 21 the year before and I went to every Flamingo Stakes until the track closed. I’ve been to every Florida Derby except two since 1976. But I remember Slew clearly in the Flamingo, winning quite easily against what was probably a far inferior field. Not sure if it was then or maybe years later when my dad talked about how amazing it was that Seattle Slew had won the Derby after having just six races. Horses with six starts in those days were probably immediate tosses. Now you can only hope that Derby runners have had as many as six starts. Slew didn’t achieve what he did on just talent alone. He needed the right trainer, and at that time maybe Billy Turner was the only trainer who could have gotten him to the winner’s circle at Churchill.
Billy and Slew were made for each other.
Wish he were given more horses,he deserved for sure.
I didnt mean to start a major conversation by asking about Eddie F. Doesnt anyone else want to talk about Billy Turner or is that it?
Fantastic article. I remember those Slew days well. 2nd best racehorse I’ve ever seen. Right behind Big Red.
The greatest race I witnessed at Belmont park was Slew, Affirmed and Excellent. What a race.
I remember the fallout with Billy. I never knew the reasons for it.
Truly he was a man that got ate up by the business.
His story would make a wonderful movie.
Thanks, Vince. That JC Gold Cup was amazing. The only time a loss defined a horse’s true greatness.
A good youtube channel is PAST THE WIRE……todays vid about baffert with a lawyer was ok…little boring………good vid “a talk with broberg” was good…….
Alright……..until i get an apology from Mike Reiva……..i am holding Eddie F hostage in by basement……troll me?…….you pay the price. It wasn’t hard, tracking down his trailer…..in Meth head tenn.
Maybe he made a new year’s resolution………..to only do things he knows about………
u r dreaming!
Should we put out an APB on Eddie F? Hope he’s OK.
Steve, this was the last post from EddieF, he was responding to the poster below.
Bill Dawson says:
December 30, 2021 at 9:22 pm
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ.
Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right, here I am stuck in the middle with you.
Give it up EddieF, you’re just not that funny.
Reply
EddieF says:
December 30, 2021 at 10:09 pm
You win. I’m gone.
As long as he’s been a valued regular on here I cant believe he would just leave over that. I doubt he would be that sensitive over someone saying he wasnt that funny, especially when most here think he is. That would be very disappointing if he left because of that.
He brings much on board here. Someone jumped him over remarks he made regarding CF.
I still cant believe any one person’s remarks would drive him away from here. Next week there will be an administrator’s comment about behavior on here. We’re extremely tame compared to other now defunct blogs, but he thinks things are beginning to turn a little and wants to nip it in the bud.
Eddie’s remarks were benign.
He wasnt thinking of Eddie F
Agreed!
I believe, EddieF used to go by ‘Nick Carraway’ previously. Anyway, Nick Carraway vanished a couple of times when he went on holidays but eventually returned. Just a guess on both accounts.
Nick Carraway, is the name of the narrator in “The Great Gatsby.” Perhaps, EddieF may return under a new nom de plume.
I remember Nick Carraway said he was leaving because his wife complained he was spending too much time on the computer and then, puff, he was gone. Will history repeat itself? We had another poster with a great sense of humor called Dr. Drunkinbum and he disappeared. Hmmm.
Dr. Drunkinbum was cool.
BelmontBarb, was excellent value as well.
And then there was Draynay, who didn’t like Zenyatta, always tossing her until her 20th start, when he said “There! I TOLD you all”….hit a big win bet on Blame! ( what was he…4-1?)…..
He was a serious disgrace. Remember him well.
Ah yes, the Jason Shandler days in The Blood-Horse. Wasn’t it just a “b1tch and sh1t” farce?
JS said I was sole one honoring a wager when Blame won ($200). Had Zen. He was a disgrace,also.
Agree Davids! He had no class.
From memory, Dr. Drunkenbum was becoming further, and further disenchanted with the influence of illegal drugs in racing. I miss his humor as well. Absolutely, hilarious at times and he knew racing from way back.
Nick was one of my favorites. He was always coming up trivia questions about the sport, races and the horses.
I remember too the beautiful prose style of writing that Belmont Barb had.
And Dr Drunkenbum too!
Would love to hear from some of these regulars over the years!
…and Windolin. Windolin was a member of a group who was trying to start up horse racing in Georgia.
Windolin had knowledge for sure regarding racing.
Steve, what a beautiful, bitter sweet story. Your article made me wish I was able to meet Mr. Turner, but through your writing I think I did. My condolence to his family and friends and thank you for telling his story .
I appreciate that, Diane. Thank you. Billy was someone everyone would have loved meeting and knowing.
Just think how different Billy’s life could have been if the Hill’s had gifted him one service a year to Seattle Slew like most other owners
I’ve been waiting for this article, Steve. Thanks
The life of a horse trainer can be a rough one. Many greats end up with not much at the end, but the horse world is better for them being in it.
I didn’t know Baffert helped with his medical bills. That was very good of him.
Again, thanks for this article.
Such a sad story, but beautifully told. It shows how we cannot narrow a person’s life down to one particular event. You must know the whole person before you judge, if you choose to judge. And how many people can say that they reach the pinnacle of their profession. Mr Turner did and I’m sure he knew it and was proud of it.
Very well said, Roberta.
I am nothing more than a 50+ year fan of the sport. Started walking hots in HS, visited Ocala last year and hit a ton of tracks here and in Europe. A fan.
Years ago when message boards were the norm for internet conversations I participated in a group with Pat Rich, soon to be Billy Turners’s wife. Members of the group would meet whenever we were at the same event and eventually I met up with Pat. She in turn introduced me to Bill.
What a gentleman. I spent some mornings on the backstretch with Bill and Patfor morning workouts at both Laurel and Gulfstream. We’d have breakfast in the kitchen and he’d talk about whoever worked that morning. I’d be at Belmont in the paddock area and whenever Bill saw me he’d take the time to walk over to say hi. To me, nothing more than a fan. Yet Bill was as gracious as could be, a man with no airs about him despite his accomplishments.
The first time I met Bill was at the barn before Slew’s work for the Wood Memorial. I was just a nobody librarian. He walked past me and said something that made me feel like I’d known him for years.
I’d like to take this opportunity to pass along my condolences to Pat should she read this.
I was saddened to read about the many difficulties he faced. I think your column gives him the respect he deserves.
Steve, one of your finest articles. A farewell, so sensitively written, that it’s taken me four attempts to finally complete the journey. Life can be so difficult for many but at least Billy Turner achieved the impossible, managing an equine avalanche. That achievement will last forever, while more notable contemporaneous names will have faded from the page.
Thank you David. So very well said.
Thanks Steve, touched. Slew is/was my favorite racehorse ever and Billy & he inextricably intertwined.
Shy, but his reverence for Slew was spellbinding.
I had the pleasure and privilege of working for Billy for awhlle back in 1976, when Slew was a 2 year old but before he made his first start. Billy was unfailingly kind, generous, and caring. It was Billy who talked me out of going to Charlestown Racetrack to gallop horses–I desperately wanted to be an exercise rider but wasn’t quite up to snuff for the caliber of horses at Belmont. Billy warned me about the serious risks involved with riding the horses there, many of whom–ironically–were unsound and unsafe mounts. He was genuinely concerned that I would get hurt. In the end I didn’t go, and he gave me some opportunities to get up on a few of his horses that he thought I could handle.
He was a true gentleman, and always had good memories of my time working for him.
Thank you for sharing that.
I was lucky enough to own a Slew grandson. I loved him and he and his grandsire are forever in my heart.
This is why horse racing grabs you like no other sport. The humanity, the revealing of character and characters. I’m so thankful that Steve Haskin, through multiple twists of fate came to write so eloquently of it.
Thanks very much.
I too hope Mr. Turner will finally find the door to the Hall of Fame open wide for him soon. That is definitely something that is long overdue. Beautifully written as always Steve even though a difficult story. Sincere condolences to Mr. Turner’s family for their loss.
There was more to Billy Turner’s life to tell than I ever realized. And I am so glad and grateful that Steve Haskin was the one to tell it. If that doesn’t equal a trip to the winner’s circle at the very end, I don’t know what does. I wish that life had extended to Billy Turner more of the tender mercies which he offered to others. And I wish most of all, that those doors to the Hall of Fame will open wide and admit him to a place which he should have inhabited long ago.
Beautifully said, Cynthia. Thank you.
…>> EXCELLENT FANTASTIC READ,SYEVE!! & I’m not just saying that~ This warmed up my day!! THANK YOU,STEVE!! On my 2nd favorite of all-time~!!~ No sorry-SEc’ isn’t my faV…But he’s way up there. 🙂
Bill Harman~
Thank you very much, Bill. I really appreciate it.
STEVE ,ALL I CAN SAY IS BILLY TURNER WAS NOT ONLY A TREMENDOUS HORSEMAN AND TRAINER HE IN MY OPINION AN EVEN A BETTER PERSON ,HE HAD SUCH HUMILITY AND A QUIET KINDNESS ABOUT HIM I CLEARLY REMEMBER MAKING SMALL TALK WITH AND HOW HE LIT UP WHEN DISCUSSING THE YEARS AND TRAINING OF SLEW ,IAM A SMALL TRAINER AND ON OCCASION HAVE HAD SOME REALLY TALENTED HORSES AND TRULEY LOVE TRAINING HORSES ,AFTER TALKING TO BILLY I COULDN’T HELP THINKING HOW LUCKY AND FORTUNATE HE MUST HAVE BEEN TO HAVE TRAINED A HORSE LIKE SLEW HOWEVER I WASN’T AWHARE OF THE PROBLEMS HE HAD AND VERY DIFFICULT LIFE HE HAD AFTER THE BIG HORSE . SOME HOW SOME WHERE THERE SHOULD BE A REAL ATTEMT TO GET HIS JUST REWARD AND GET HIM INTO THE HALL OF FAME ,THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEAUTIFUL FAREWELL STORY ABOUT A TRULEY HERO TO OUR SPORT
Many didnt realize it, Eddie. That’s why it is a story with a sad ending
It is a shame that most folks don’t realize what they have (had) until they lose it. I don’t know anyone who hasn’t experienced the highs & lows of the journey through life.
Your blog was hard to read but it was an amazing write. When you write of your blogs they are usually about the horses. I am glad you took the time & effort to write this story. It needed to be told & I felt blessed after I read this.
Your writings continue to impress & your ability to articulate & tell a story simply blows me away.
Seattle Slew was an amazing horse, he more then out shined those who owned him & handled him.
Thank you for sharing…….
That’s very kind of you Deacon. It was difficult to write, but as you said it needed to be told.
Beautifully written. Sad, that such an able horseman could not get a decent horse, MacAnally has had to race his own, relying on his one yearly Candy Ride mating. Conquering the alcohol was a big accomplishment! Slew’s second trainer–whom I knew and liked did not fare as well, in that department. The owners, and trainers came and went— but Slew abides!
Beautifully written and while a sad story, one that shouldn’t be forgotten. Thank you for writing and sharing this.
Mrs. Obre’s Andor Farm still stands today (new owners now) and the barn Slew was in is still around. We moved in down the street from there around the same time Slew was there. My neighbors helped out in the barn as teens. Sadly, I was only five and did not become a horse crazy kid until a few years later!
That barn should a shrine. It was like Frank Whiteley showing the barn and stall Ruffian was in when he first got her at the Camden training center.
Beautifully written!
Thanks Mike
Thank you, Steve ~ I am so glad for every word you wrote in here. I followed Slew and Billy closely in ‘77 and was maddened by the events after Slew’s Triple …. And so proud of his wins the following year. On a rare visit to Belmont one day in 2014, I was thrilled to see Billy Turner with his horse in the winner’s circle .. As if nothing had changed in 37 years. Thank You!!
So grateful Steve that you wrote this beautiful and moving account of the life of Billy Turner. I learned things that I never knew about him; what a kind and giving person he was and how bravely he fought his demons and the cancer that finally took his life.
He will always be remembered in all the annals of the history of horse racing and the great Seattle Slew.
My deepest and most heartfelt condolences to his family and loved ones. May they be blessed with God’s tender mercies that Billy is at peace and will always live in their hearts and ours.
Beautifully said, Lynda. Thank you
I often wondered what happened to Billy Turner . I heard he had objected to sending Slew to the Swaps stakes but I knew nothing about the drinking problem . It’s a sad story . Thank you for this tribute to a fine man who trained a magnificent horse.
He did object sending Slew to Swaps, rightfully so.
There s more to that in my column “The Life and Death of Seattle Slew.” Goes into more detail.
Thanks!
Thank you for telling us all the stories, especially the ones no one else seems to know or tell.
A sad and beautiful elegy for a truly under-appreciated trainer and human being. Thank you Steve, for such a moving tribute.
May he rest in peace.